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notyet notyet is offline
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the freedom from religion foundation has purchased bus ads in the seattle area. the copy reads:



i have yet to see the ads but did hear of them this afternoon on a radio call-in show.

comments? thoughts?
Last edited by notyet; November 11th, 2009 at 08:17 am.
- November 4th, 2009, 01:41 pm
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jsbach jsbach is offline
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Seems kind of silly and needless.

Couldn't that group have used the money they spent for the ads in a more profitable way?

I mean, what's to gain by trying to take away people's hope?

If you believed in E.T.s and I didn't, why should I bother or care about something I didn't think was real?
- November 4th, 2009, 05:29 pm
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Though I obviously don't agree with the ads, I fully support their right to have them. It bothers me when free speech only applies to that speech we agree with. If we are to retain our right to free speech, we need to guarantee it even for those we disagree with.

First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out — because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out — because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out — because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out — because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me — and there was no one left to speak out for me. ~~ Martin Niemöller (c. 1946)

The author was originally an avid supporter of Hitler, up until the time Hitler decided the state was to rule over the church. Hence the change of heart and subsequent poem.
- November 4th, 2009, 06:12 pm
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jsbach jsbach is offline
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Of course they have a right to free speech. I take that for granted. I didn't think that question was even on the table.
- November 4th, 2009, 06:54 pm
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jsbach wrote :
Of course they have a right to free speech. I take that for granted. I didn't think that question was even on the table.
Oh no, I didn't think you were saying that they should be banned at all. I do know there is generally some kind of movement to boycott/ban messages like this from some of the more vocal groups. Happens every time.

Personally, I think they're helping out Christians more than they know, since it's definitely a conversation starter.
- November 4th, 2009, 07:10 pm
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Basically, that's preaching to the choir in Seattle, since Washington is the most unchurched state in the nation, and King County the most unchurched county within the state.

I reiterate the statements reflecting the right to free speech. What someone says may make my blood boil, but I will defend their right to say it. However, I do have a problem with absolutist claims. But on the other hand, if parents did not encourage childrens fantasies about Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy in the first place, perhaps there would be less confusion later in life? "Ok kids, everything you were told about Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are not real. But everything you were told about the Bible is real - Jonah and the Great Fish, the Virgin Birth, etc...
- November 4th, 2009, 07:31 pm
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rix wrote :
But on the other hand, if parents did not encourage childrens fantasies about Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy in the first place, perhaps there would be less confusion later in life? "Ok kids, everything you were told about Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy are not real. But everything you were told about the Bible is real - Jonah and the Great Fish, the Virgin Birth, etc...
Yep. Good point.

But you have to admit. It's a bit tough being the only kid in school that Santa doesn't visit. Though I guess it doesn't matter as long as you still get the presents...
- November 4th, 2009, 07:39 pm
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Childhood thrives on magical thinking.

What? So no Dora, Mickey Mouse, Bob the Builder, Wizard of Oz (How many "Dorothys do you see at Halloween?). No Scoobydo, Charlie Brown and Snoopy, StrawberryShortcake, Heidi, Paul Bunyan?

Pert near anything a child doesn't understand has "magic" involved in it.
Including childbirth and the Stork.

I remember being 3 and my great aunt's midsection was about even to my head and three times as big. I inquired about her tummy and was told that she had swallowed a watermelon seed. Everyone laughed while quietly I pondered that answer.

Funny, not long after that my aunt gave birth to a new cousin for me!

I never felt betrayed by the fun stories and the true stories. When I was an older child or even now.

Motive plays a big factor here. If a story isn't told with malice and the purpose of hurting someone is an important caveat here.
- November 4th, 2009, 08:00 pm
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chawks64 wrote :
Yep. Good point.

But you have to admit. It's a bit tough being the only kid in school that Santa doesn't visit. Though I guess it doesn't matter as long as you still get the presents...

Yep, that would be rough. I'm glad Santa was good to me as boy. I'm surprised how the tooth fairy's rate has changed through the years. I use to only only get a dollar, but now my nieces and nephews get toys. Try sleeping with a Tonka dump truck under your pillow! The rate must have changed due to inflation.

However, sometimes I swear (and yes, I do swear) that this state is on the lunatic fringe, not only philosophically, but politically. Recently on the local news, Gov. Chris Gregoire (D) and Senator Patty Murray (D) both expressed how angry, upset, etc. they were that Boeing decided to move a plant of operations to South Carolina. Well, what the hell do they expect, when you have policies in place that are not favorable to the operations of business? The Pacific Northwest is a beautiful place. But, we certainly have the lunatic fringe out of touch with reality!
- November 4th, 2009, 08:11 pm
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rix wrote :
...Jonah and the Great Fish...
you know, it is this attention that you pay to the littlest detail...

well done and well said above- that is one of the reasons i did not allow my children to believe in santa et al. a lot of people think it is no big deal. but i strive for consistency. i do not always attain it, but i try.

and i think that the more consistent one is, the easier it makes other things later. it is best to separate fact from fantasy early.
Last edited by notyet; November 4th, 2009 at 10:02 pm. Reason: most would have called it... well you know what they would have called it!
- November 4th, 2009, 09:55 pm
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